Poor Performance / Downtime

Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: leepr
Posted on: 2008-03-05 15:46:00

Hello there,

I thought I might get some fellow DreamHost customers input on this. I just moved over a couple of (low-traffic, but important) web sites from 1&1 to DreamHost. I've been a customer for one week and have had to submit a trouble ticket almost every day.

I'm delighted with the technical support and customer service, but the actual hosting service has been terrible so far.

In the past 4 days, my sites have been unreachable 3 times (for hours at a time). I'm on the Kyrie server. The first excuse was that some user was running processes they should be. Fair enough. The second excuse was that there was a load issue and that the server would have to be reloaded. Today, my sites are down again - and they were slow as hell all morning. I demanded that DreamHost credit my account for 2 days of no service - hoping for a few cents - they gave me a full month's credit. Nice of them.

Anyway, with 1&1 customer/technical support was useless much like their web panel, but at least my sites were fast and always available. Both my 1&1 and DreamHost accounts were for a shared server ~ $10 per month.

Is this just a bad week for DreamHost? Should I go back to 1&1? Again, I love DreamHost - excellent support, and human-readable-often-funny blogs, newsletters, email responses, etc. but the service thus far has been deplorable.

Cheers in advance for any replies,
LeePR

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: sdayman
Posted on: 2008-03-05 15:51:00

Keep nagging every time it goes down. In some cases, they move impacted users to another server.

-Scott

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: leepr
Posted on: 2008-03-05 15:58:00

Are you the same Scott that answered my trouble ticket last night? That Scott told me, "if you'd like to be moved to another server, just let us know. We'd be happy to help you out as much as we can."

I'm looking through the forum now and it seems (from other posts) that it's fairly typical to see a speed increase when you're moved to another server, but it'll just come back to haunt you in a few months - same thing over and over again.

Is there anyone on here that's never had a problem a DreamHost server being slow/down? If so, please let me know and I'll see if I can request to be put on that one instead :-)

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: sdayman
Posted on: 2008-03-05 16:21:00

Nope. Employees usually have a little yellow bubble above their username in the forum list.

-Scott

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-05 17:11:00

That is because DH has more and more customers.

Although we don't encourage people moving between servers, you can request it if your server is really slow. DH will be there to manage your servers.

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-05 20:08:00

In reply to:

That is because DH has more and more customers.


I'll reassert my claim that the problems are the same as they've always been - there has always been some number of unfortunate customers who end up on servers that have problems.

The old-timers can verify that someone comes here to the forums to complain about slowness every couple of weeks. The answer is always the same, either:
1. Submit an accurate and precise support ticket
2. Analyze your site and figure out why it's slow
3. Your site is itself the problem. It is inappropriate for a shared web hosting account. You should upgrade to a dedicated server or (recently) a Dreamhost PS account.
4. Ask to be moved to a different server.

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: mpro
Posted on: 2008-03-15 02:56:00

you're not alone...
me too have the same problem almost everyday.
i have been with DH for 2 weeks. and my site down everyday.
They finally give me 1 month free...
I dont want their 1 month free.. I want my site is always up and running... I dont want they give me free 1 month, and I keep getting site down/slow for another 12 months.

i'm tired.. of reporting site down site down...
and waiting the customer support to response.

this is my account #395053

please DH.. fix the problem.... or move me to better / not overloaded server.

thank you

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-15 11:38:00

In reply to:

this is my account #(censored)

please DH.. fix the problem.... or move me to better / not overloaded server.


Please remember that these are customer-to-customer forums and not regularly read by Dreamhost staff.

You might also want to clip out your account number...

Good luck with your problems. My wife says her server has been having some problems for the past month as well.

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: qmaine
Posted on: 2008-03-15 20:04:00

Yep. Our server has been "under a high load" recently, according to DreamHost's own tests. They had to reboot our server at least twice within a few weeks. I know the OP doesn't want to hear this, but you get what you pay for. Unless you're on a dedicated server, then you can't really expect much more from DreamHost. I think they're good, overall, though.

http://WebsiteHacks.com
website development and computer help

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-15 20:43:00

In reply to:

I know the OP doesn't want to hear this, but you get what you pay for. Unless you're on a dedicated server, then you can't really expect much more from DreamHost. I think they're good, overall, though.


I think Dreamhost has been working on the problem my wife has been experiencing for about a month. It's caused problems off and on for that period of time, but performance has been good other than those times when the filer becomes overwhelmed.

OTOH, my sites have been fine and I never really had this particular problem anytime in the past - well, the occasional one that got worked out in a few hours, but nothing like this.
I'm sure DH is working hard on the problem and will get it solved, though. I don't think people should expect such slowness as the rule here, but rather as the exception.

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-15 21:41:00

I think this goes back to the same problem. How to manage users in shared servers with such a low price. If a website has more than 800 visitors a day, it will definitely affect its neighbors in the same server. The site owner will encounter a serious slowness and it will be the time to switch to dedicated server.

DH has 500,000 domains to manager. It is not a easy job but I believe they are working hard on it.

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: rlparker
Posted on: 2008-03-15 22:36:00

In reply to:

If a website has more than 800 visitors a day, it will definitely affect its neighbors in the same server. The site owner will encounter a serious slowness and it will be the time to switch to dedicated server.


Patrick, I don't think that is an accurate statement.

800 visitors in a day *could* create a problem, depending upon what those visitors are doing at the site and how the site is coded, but not necessarily.

800 visitors a day each viewing a few static webpages wouldn't even be noticed on most servers, while 800 visitors pounding a dynamic database-driven application heavily with repeated searches and generating tens of thousands of inefficient database queries could create a problem. wink

--rlparker

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-16 01:47:00

hmm.... Recently I read a book [strategies for web hosting and managed services]. It discussed the differences between shared hosting and dedicated hosting.

The book gives an average 800 visitors per day as a reference. It suggests people to consider to switch to dedicated server if the site has more than 800 visitors a day.

I believe this is just an average measurement. As you mentioned, if those visitors just view few static webpages, it should be still fine. If more activities that require more server resources are often queried, the site may suffer slowness.

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: KingOfChaos
Posted on: 2008-03-16 02:55:00

I am thinking of asking to move from megaman to another server myself. I have had a lot of speed issues, like right now...It's taking nearly 3 minutes for the server to respond to user requests. The server just has too many users on it.

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-16 06:14:00

3 mins for a server to respond is really slow. A support ticket should get DH's attention.

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-16 10:50:00

In reply to:

It's taking nearly 3 minutes for the server to respond to user requests. The server just has too many users on it.


What are you running on the server? Is it an off-the-shelf web application or did you write it yourself?

Is the 3 minutes to just display a static web page? How long does your server take to respond to a vanilla wordpress install?

I'd assert that 3 minutes is a suspiciously long time to be waiting for a page and it's not simply a server that's overloaded with users, but rather a server that either has one user's site pounding it to oblivion or that has a problem with it's NFS server. What does support say?

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-16 10:55:00

In reply to:

hmm.... Recently I read a book [strategies for web hosting and managed services]. It discussed the differences between shared hosting and dedicated hosting.

The book gives an average 800 visitors per day as a reference. It suggests people to consider to switch to dedicated server if the site has more than 800 visitors a day.


I'd be leery of these "rules of thumb". Where does the author get this rule? Is it based on a monetization metric or is it based on a use metric?

For instance, one web application we have at work can take 1-2 simultaneous users per dedicated server. Users would stay on the system for between 1 and 4 hours. Admittedly it's a pretty hefty application. :)

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-16 18:27:00

In reply to:

Where does the author get this rule? Is it based on a monetization metric or is it based on a use metric?


I have no idea. Maybe I am too rushing to share it.

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: supernova
Posted on: 2008-03-18 04:35:00

In reply to:

The book gives an average 800 visitors per day as a reference. It suggests people to consider to switch to dedicated server if the site has more than 800 visitors a day.


Patrick, can you reference me what book you are reading ? I think my sites (with more than 4 domains) receive more than 800 visitors per day combined.


Supernova

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: sdayman
Posted on: 2008-03-18 06:36:00

I'd throw that 800/day tidbit out the window. It means nothing if everybody else on the shared server has only 5 visits a day, or 5000 visits a day.

If you're overloading the server, DreamHost will let you know. If someone else is overloading the server, complain to Support.

-Scott

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: supernova
Posted on: 2008-03-18 09:48:00

In reply to:

If someone else is overloading the server, complain to Support.


How do we check on that ?

Thanks !


Supernova

Need promo codes ? Check on this link.

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: IAmAtMyWitsEnd
Posted on: 2008-03-18 11:36:00

LeePR,

Wow did you make a huge mistake :p - I have been with DH for a little over four years now...initially I was referred over here by a good friend (not one of the promocode whores) and when I first started here, it was pretty good. Solid uptimes & responsive support ques-at the time I was hosting many of my high volume & client sites here-than right around the time that the 'code monster' sales went into effect (coupled with the promocode whoring) dreamhost took a radical downturn and has not sniffed even decent uptime since. Around mid 2005, I was fed up with the downtimes & my own angry client base so I had to make a decision, either try to ride out the mess of what DH had become or risk losing my longstanding monthly maintenance contracts with my clients-which do you think I chose? :P Anywho, I actually landed @ 1and1 due to their low registration fees and I figured that I would give their hosting a try as well, by the end of 2005, I had moved ALL of my client sites over to 1and1 and only keep personal/project sites @DH and that is only until they become monetized (than I move them to the far more stable 1and1). I the three + years that I have been with 1and1, I have not witnessed even one occassion of downtime + even though 1and1's support division is obviously located outside of US (either india/mexico/phillipines) they have ALWAYS answered any questions that I have fully & in good english. DH, my friend, DOES NOT EVEN HAVE A PUBLISHED SUPPORT PHONE NUMBER...and they rarely respond to the 'callback' requests. All that aside, however, all you need to know is that DH will bury you in downtime if you have client or monetized websites....while 1and1's webpanel may not be as 'glitzy' or as 'Happy :p' - it will be FAR MORE available than DH's will be over any period of time...Others (the promocode whores) will dismiss my comments as simply 'one displeased customer' however, I can tell you that at this time DH's usage is limited to illegal file sharer's and the likes (due to the unlimited bandwith+), however, real non promocode peeps like myself moved our business operations off of DH many years ago....if you want to cry a little bit, check out DH's own status page= dreamhoststatus.com..it would be comical if it weren't true and to know that many web designers are losing their clients left & right due to these antics....here is a word that is sure to baffle anyone wearing a DH uniform = REDUNDANCY :p LOL

Honestly though, as much goes, DH has it's place, they are a good host for $5.95/month as long as you don't have paying clients or monetized sites.

IAmAtMyWitsEnd aka promoCodeSLAYER

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: sdayman
Posted on: 2008-03-18 11:59:00

SSH into your server and type 'uptime' which will show you the load averages. 5 is a bit high (mine's at 10 right now, which still performs, but is worrying). If it's always in double digits, then there's a problem and I'd recommend filing a support ticket (if your site is impacted).

-Scott

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: scjessey
Posted on: 2008-03-18 12:13:00

In reply to:

Wow did you make a huge mistake :p - I have been with DH for a little over four years now...initially I was referred over here by a good friend (not one of the promocode whores) blah blah blahdy-blah...


Did anyone else find that paragraph really hard to read? Also, isn't that a promo code in your signature too?



-- si-blog --

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: rlparker
Posted on: 2008-03-18 12:54:00

leepr,

Well, now that IAmAtMyWItsEnd has weighed in, and in the interests of "balance", I'll throw my thoughts into the discussion. wink

There is no doubt that DreamHost has had some problems of late, but my experience has been considerably different than that of IAmAtMyWitsEnd. I've hosted sites at DreamHost for almost 10 years now and, while I have seen performance and downtime issues arise from time to time, I have also seen them resolved and managed.

My overall experience with DreamHost remains positive and for me, and my clients, the flexibility and power DreamHost offers for what they charge still makes DreamHost a viable alternative and I am happy to host my clients here if their site is suitable for *any* shared hosting provider's service.

In reply to:

...all you need to know is that DH will bury you in downtime if you have client or monetized websites....


Well, I suppose that might be true if "all you need to know" is IAmAtMyWitsWnd's opinion - personally I'd rather be astute enough to recognize that others' experiences are likely to vary. The economics of webhosting are such that if the majority of users are dissatisfied with performance and uptime, the host will not survive; I suggest that DreamHost's continued growth, warts and all, is an indication that they do much more "right" than they do "wrong".

In reply to:

.. 1and1's webpanel may not be as 'glitzy' or as 'Happy :p' - it will be FAR MORE available than DH's will be over any period of time


That's an interesting claim, but it fails on it's face - who knows what will happen over "any period of time". I know that begs the obvious, but it is also indicative of the passionate negative feelings some frustrated customers/ex-customers will express. Does frustration beget exaggeration? Sometimes, I think it does.wink

In reply to:

Others (the promocode whores) will dismiss my comments as simply 'one displeased customer' however, I can tell you that at this time DH's usage is limited to illegal file sharer's and the likes (due to the unlimited bandwith+)...


I can't speak for the "promocode whores" (I don't use them myself, except to pass along a discount on rare occasion, and only upon request), but, while not dismissing IAmaAtMyWitsEnd's comments "simply", I think they are primarily indicative of *his* experience, and *not* the general experience of most DreamHost customers.

It's also patently ridiculous to assert that "at this time DH's usage is limited to illegal file sharer's and the likes (due to the unlimited bandwith+)". To me, that level of exaggeration triggers a warning about the voracity of the opinion offered.

Have the low-cost first-year promocodes resulted in some abusers trying to use DreamHost in this way (considering the account almost a "throw-away" because of how little it cost that first year)? No doubt! That said, DreamHost routinely throws those folks off the service for TOS violations, and their recent changing of the promo code system to curtail the amount of discount given is a step in the right direction toward reducing that kind of business.

Frankly, I'd rather see those promocodes either go away, or be severely curtailed, but I understand that DreamHost feels they need to offer such a program to remain competitive in *their* market, so meh.

In reply to:

however, real non promocode peeps like myself moved our business operations off of DH many years ago


Maybe some have, but certainly not all - I, and many other developers I know, still use DreamHost for sites that are suitable for hosting on a shared server, and I still find the overall performance/value ratio to be outstanding (and I consider myself a "real non promocode peep').

In reply to:

....if you want to cry a little bit, check out DH's own status page= dreamhoststatus.com..it would be comical if it weren't true


Looking at dreamhoststatus.com doesn't me me cry (well,at least not most of the time) - I very much appreciate the look at what it takes to keep a hosting business running, and I like seeing candid acknowledgment of the kinds of problems that *all* hosting providers encounter (and most will never admit to!). I'll admit that it would be a better "tool" without the idiotic blathering the comment section has become (gawd, I am convinced that, by and large, blog comment sections are the true toilets of the internet), but it does have it's entertainment value. wink

In reply to:

...to know that many web designers are losing their clients left & right due to these antics....


A web designer that loses their clients because of the level of problems on DreamHost is just not properly managing those clients. If the client's sensitivity to the occasional outage is sufficiently high that a hosting glitch prompts them to bolt, they should have never been hosted on an inexpensive shared platform in the first place. The "web designer" that put them there was either not intelligent, or educated, enough to identify that in the first place or was so careless in monitoring the state of the account and the client's satisfaction that he/she missed the opportunity to meet the client's needs. Blaming a web host for losing a client is ridiculous - you can always recommend they change hosts, and if you don't do that when you should, you deserve to lose that client.

There have been two or three instances over the years where I was faced with this issue. In each case, *I* contacted the client with accurate information about the issue, detailed the available alternatives, and encouraged the client make the business decision they felt was in their best interest. Interestingly, in each of those cases, the client ultimately decided the best business decision for them to make was to remain with DreamHost, as the value received greatly outweighed the inconvenience/frustration encountered.

The point to all my comments is this: YMMV, one host is not the "best" host for everyone, you should make your own decisions about what is best for you (and your clients), and the opinion of a satisfied customer is no less valuable than that of a dissatisfied customer. smile

--rlparker

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: IAmAtMyWitsEnd
Posted on: 2008-03-18 13:03:00

Simon,

My apologies, I should have written it right to left :p that is the only way you pommies know how to read and yes, I do have a promocode in my sig: promocodeSLAYER - my code gives you $0/0 free domains/0% off a really lousy hosting plan ;)

IAmAtMyWitsEnd aka promoCodeSLAYER

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-18 13:04:00

In reply to:

Also, isn't that a promo code in your signature too?


I don't think it is. IAmAtMyWitsEnd has always been very clear on his feeling against the posting of promo codes in this forum. There was even a whole subthread about it back in October, I think.

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: rlparker
Posted on: 2008-03-18 13:14:00

In reply to:

IAmAtMyWitsEnd has always been very clear on his feeling against the posting of promo codes in this forum.


I seriously doubt that is a promocode also ... I see it more as a moniker!

IIRC, from prior discussion, IAmAtMyWitsEnd feels the whole promo code business in general works to the web hosting industry's detriment ... and to a certain degree, I agree with him on that (but that is considerably off topic for this thread wink).

--rlparker

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-18 19:03:00

I'm not sure whether the book will help. From the comments from others, it seems the number is just a number "for reference". Whether your site is healthy on a shared server depends on some other factors as well.

The book was given by my VP. The name of the book is [strategies for web hosting and managed services]. Please take your own risk tongue

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-18 19:07:00

In reply to:

Did anyone else find that paragraph really hard to read?


INDEED.

I thought he was trying to give advices. But he just recommended to move from a shared server to another shared server (in another company). frown

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: sdayman
Posted on: 2008-03-18 19:12:00

In reply to:

I thought he was trying to give advices. But he just recommended to move from a shared server to another shared server (in another company).



Sounds good to me. Take your problems elsewhere. Make them someone else's problems.

-Scott

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-18 19:36:00

In reply to:

Take your problems elsewhere. Make them someone else's problems.


ha ha ha ha.. I can't stop laughing at your comment. Thumbs Up!

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-18 19:45:00

In reply to:

But he just recommended to move from a shared server to another shared server (in another company).


Well, he's recommending one shared hosting company over another for a variety of reasons he goes into in his post. You may or may not agree with his observations and you may or may not have had the same experiences that he's had, but I don't think there's any need to ridicule the man. I mean, there he may be guilty of over generalization, but let's try to keep it civil in here...

More paragraph breaks would be very helpful, though!

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: IAmAtMyWitsEnd
Posted on: 2008-03-18 22:18:00

Sorry for the confusion I have caused and if you will allow me to fornicate my redemption :p

using shared servers (no matter the hosting company or situation) will always have you behind the 8 ball to some extent-I was simply attempting to illustrate (phoenetically) that DH has really suffered for a good bit now and that 1and1 has definitely been far more stable overall....

IAmAtMyWitsEnd aka promoCodeSLAYER

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: patricktan
Posted on: 2008-03-19 01:54:00

In reply to:

I was simply attempting to illustrate (phoenetically) that DH has really suffered for a good bit now


Hopefully it is not true..

Btw, I visited 1and1 website. They offer reasonable/less overselling hosting plans. The *best* overselling hosting plan I see before is UNLIMITED web space, UNLIMITED traffic, UNLIMITED subdomains, 100 database, and 5000 email accounts with $7.95/mo. almost EVERYTHING UNLIMITED!

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: scjessey
Posted on: 2008-03-19 06:44:00

In reply to:

1and1 has definitely been far more stable overall....


First off, I apologize for erroneously thinking you were on the promo code gravy train. It gets a little confusing after a while, what with certain well-known trolls obfuscating their signatures to make it hard to figure out what is going on. So my bad on that.

Secondly, I have to tell you that I have considerable experience with 1&1 (Schlund) because I used to host all of my European domains over there. I had nothing but trouble at the time. I wasn't able to get enough flexibility with the features I needed, they were expensive, and the technical knowledge of their support staff was woefully bad. This was about 4 years ago, so things may have improved since then, but my fingers were badly burned at the time.

I'm certainly not afraid to move hosts if I perceive things to be getting difficult, and I have done so on numerous occasions. I manage around 40 websites at the moment, and they are spread over 3 different hosts; however, the bulk of those sites are now hosted here. Previously, the longest period a hosting company has retained my custom for is 18 months. It is a testament to the quality, price and level of support from DreamHost that I have enjoyed hosting here for 4 years. Indeed, I foresee remaining a customer for the bulk of my domains for many years to come, if the last 4 are an accurate gauge.

-- si-blog --

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: IAmAtMyWitsEnd
Posted on: 2008-03-19 21:38:00

Mr. Parker,

While I do appreciate your stance & opinion on what you have soo graciously elaborated upon, I would like to state one (small) fact....you have posted in the discussion forums over 200x since 3/2 alone and I personally do not know of a full service web designer that could possibly have enough time to post as actively as you do in here (maybe you are simply better at time management than I am). I doubt I have posted a total of 200x in the past 4 years. DH is what it is..it is a good $5.95/month webhost-my only problem is that I am paying $20 month for this $6 value. However, I myself, do not understand sometimes why I post in this forum....maybe it is simply because too many in here have been completely polluted by the promocode thingie & I want a BALANCED outlook on what some may be getting themselves into. While I know I may be a newbie by some DH standards (4+ years), I will say that I am not alone as to other members of the 'old guard' who have simply left DH (never to be heard from again). I run into some of these folks in some of the SEO & WMW forums and they speak of much cheerier times (myself included since I left for 1and1). I guess the only reason why I continue to hang around is the hope that someday DH will finally 'right it's ship' once more & become a valuable hosting plan - My brother was with DH since the absolute beginning (he has since moved his *private servers* over to 1and1 as well) and he spoke soo highly of DH & DH delivered in the beginning-however, the last 3 years have been sketchy at best.

If you have a $6/month budget, DH could be a good fit for you. If you are a professional with a larger budget, I would seriously look at the RackSpace/1and1/ICDSoft/DataPipe

http://uptime.besthostratings.com/viewreport.php?host=DreamHost

DH has had at least 1 hour of downtime EVERY MONTH since March 2006 - you have to goto page 24 simply to find DH:

http://uptime.besthostratings.com/webhosts-uptime.php?page=24&order=uptime&sort=desc

statistics do not lie. Most in the business could easily correlate a 1 hour downtime to a $50 loss and they consistently run at least 1 hour each and every month and while some may say that isn't a big deal that 99.3% is enough uptime - I simply cannot agree - Anything under 99.8% is simply awful in the hosting business. This is my opinion.

IAmAtMyWitsEnd aka promoCodeSLAYER

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: rlparker
Posted on: 2008-03-19 22:53:00

In reply to:

I would like to state one (small) fact....you have posted in the discussion forums over 200x since 3/2 alone and I personally do not know of a full service web designer that could possibly have enough time to post as actively as you do in here (maybe you are simply better at time management than I am).


Ha ha ha! Well, it *may* be that I am better a time management that are you, but I think it is more likely the differences in what we do, and how we do it. wink I do not consider myself a "web designer" at all, I'm a web developer, or producer, and I have help! I also don't sleep much (I never have since my military days) and a *lot* of my posting here, and my IRC time, is in the wee hours of the morning when *normal* folks sleep. Additionally, I determined years ago that when I could afford to do so, I would spend time trying to "pay forward" the help I was given by the "old timers" when I first got into this business - sometimes I've even been known to do it at the expense of paying work (hell, I'm *trying* to retire!).

That said, I'm not sure how "that one (small) fact" is relevant at all to my evaluation of 10 years of hosting experience at DreamHost, unless you are intimating that I am not a working web professional - and I'm sure you wouldn't do that! wink

In reply to:

While I know I may be a newbie by some DH standards (4+ years), I will say that I am not alone as to other members of the 'old guard' who have simply left DH (never to be heard from again). I run into some of these folks in some of the SEO & WMW forums and they speak of much cheerier times...


I too remember the "cheerier" times, and have hated to see some of the changes, but that doesn't make me value the things that are good about the "new generation" DreamHost. It *is* a very different place than when I first started hosting sites here, but I still like it, and believe it is a good value for what it is.

In reply to:

If you have a $6/month budget, DH could be a good fit for you. If you are a professional with a larger budget, I would seriously look at ....


I believe that DreamHost can be a good fit even for "professionals" and those clients with larger budgets .. it's all about the sensitivity to downtime and the economics of it all. It's particularly good for professional developers who want the platform flexibility to produce sites for clients who would rather spend their money on site development than hosting costs. Not everyone needs 5 nines, and for some business models, it *may* not be worth the cost to have 5 nines. During DreamHost's sketchier moments, I've presented many of those same alternative hosts to clients, but have yet had one decide it was worth it *to them* to move - it's irrelevant to me, because I get paid either way (I get paid for my development work and consulting, not through any back-door promocode touting or affiliate programs).

In reply to:

DH has had at least 1 hour of downtime EVERY MONTH since March 2006 ...


A lot of clients can stand an hour's worth of downtime a month, and not even notice it. Some of those clients would rather suffer that downtime than pay much higher costs not to have that dead hour; my point is simply that one size does not fit all and all clients do not have the same priorities. It's also true that not all DreamHost customers suffer that hour of downtime; some will and some won't - there are a *LOT* of servers involved here and, as I said before, not everyone's experience is the same.

In reply to:

statistics do not lie. Most in the business could easily correlate a 1 hour downtime to a $50 loss and they consistently run at least 1 hour each and every month and while some may say that isn't a big deal that 99.3% is enough uptime - I simply cannot agree - Anything under 99.8% is simply awful in the hosting business. This is my opinion.


Statistics do not lie; but they most certainly are interpreted differently by different people with different perspectives and values.

Using your own example, let's say that a client has the bad luck to actually experience 12 months with an hour of downtime and it actually does cost them $50.00 each time: It would cost them $600.00. While that has never been the case on DreamHost for any of my clients, if it *was* the case, the client would need to evaluate that $600.00 "cost" in light of the cost to move and redeploy their site(s) and any additional hosting costs - for many, over a year's time, that's at best a "wash" and might actually be more expensive to move than it is to suffer the downtime. It's all about the clients' financial sensitivity to the downtime *and* their *actual* experience. My clients' experience has not been such that it is worth it for them to move.

I don't disagree with everything you have said by any means; I just have a different opinion than you do on the general suitability of hosting with DreamHost and believe that each case should be evaluated on its own merits.

99.8% uptime may be "simply awful" for some, while quite tolerable, in light of their total business posture, for others. This is my experience.

--rlparker

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: rlparker
Posted on: 2008-03-19 23:19:00

In reply to:

DH is what it is-it is a good $5.95/month webhost-... my only problem is that I am paying $20 month for this $6 value


I'm sorry I just noticed that (or it just sunk in!). Why are you doing that? You can change your plan to the single shared server plan at any time and realize the new pricing. smile

I have not done that myself as I like the "extras" my grandfathered "Code Warrior" account provides for $20.00 a month, but you certainly could cut your costs by more than half by filling out a form and submitting it.

--rlparker

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: Lensman
Posted on: 2008-03-20 00:53:00

In reply to:

statistics do not lie. Most in the business could easily correlate a 1 hour downtime to a $50 loss and they consistently run at least 1 hour each and every month and while some may say that isn't a big deal that 99.3% is enough uptime - I simply cannot agree - Anything under 99.8% is simply awful in the hosting business. This is my opinion.


I was hoping your statement was true at least in the case of the site that you mentioned, but then I noticed that they gather their statistics from their web monitoring customers. They have a small handful of *actual working client websites* and measure the uptime of those sites. It's also not clear to me that they're not biased by their affiliate relationships - though that's not saying that they're not, I'm just very leery of most every site that rates or reviews products or services and which also derives a significant portion of their income from the very companies they review/rate. Additionally, I don't think you can derive statistically significant results from testing 3 not-so-random people's websites every half hour for two years.

That said, I wouldn't claim that Dreamhost has the best uptime in the business.

That said, uptime is only one of the criteria that I use to find a host. I use the standard matrix of uptime, performance, support, features, and price - not necessarily in that order.

BTW, if anyone reading this thread is looking for honest discussion or reviews, there are a few sites that I'd recommend, but I'm not sure I want to pollute this thread with a discussion of the pros and cons of specific sites more than I already have - and for which I apologize.

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Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: qmaine
Posted on: 2008-03-22 13:22:00

"If you're overloading the server, DreamHost will let you know. "

Yes, they will. :D
I was testing a script once and it messed up their server (didn't know until they emailed us), so they restricted access to all of our sites until everything was fixed. This happened over the course of a day - testing the site, which caused it to crash, them shutting our sites down, and then giving access again once we explain what happened. Like someone else said, just complain if you think the problem is from another site and I guess they will investigate, as in our case.

You asked how to report/complain to DreamHost-I didn't read all of the thread, so don't know if someone explained to you. Try contacting them through your control panel. At the bottom left side, click Contact Support. Also, try doing an Account Test before emailing them.

http://WebsiteHacks.com
website development and computer helpEdited by qmaine on 03/22/08 01:26 PM (server time).

Re: Poor Performance / Downtime

Posted by: eike
Posted on: 2008-03-30 09:02:00

The author of that book is either mistaken, or you are misquoting him. 800 visitors a day is one visitor every 108 seconds. Moving that to a dedicated server is just wasteful.

Tags: downtimefellowtrafficdowntimefellowtraffic